Dec. 15, 2021

ESPN's Christina Buswell on the power of podcasts, 'Call Her Daddy' & her crazy career journey.

26-year-old Christina Buswell of ESPN joins the show for a conversation about our mutual love of podcasts, why they're so hot right now and why they aren't going anywhere anytime soon. Plus, we also discuss:

  • the complicated process of buying a house (2:20)
  • the power of audio and why it will never go away (15:25)
  • why Call Her Daddy is the best podcast in the world (19:30)
  • how podcasts made Christina and I feel better during tough times (23:30)
  • why it's important for young people to keep trying out jobs until you find the right one (32:00)

and so much more! If you want to see this video on my YouTube channel, check it out here.

Christina Buswell is a podcast producer at ESPN. Most known for her work with Katie Nolan on Sports?, Christina now produces The Adam Schefter Podcast, DC & RC, The Daily Wager, First Take, Her Take and more. Before starting at ESPN in January 2020, Christina worked at ESPN Los Angeles, NFL Network, and a country music station in Nashville, TN, among other places.

You can follow Christina on Twitter @ItsMeChristinaE and on Instagram @ChristinaBuswell.

Click these links to give me a follow on Instagram, visit my web site or subscribe to my podcast.

peace and love.


An absolute pleasure to welcome to the show this week, someone who I would throw into the category of one of my favorite people on earth that I really don't know that well I'm of course talking about Christina Buswell, Christina, we met January, 2020.

You got hired at ESPN. And so. Came into, uh, the little pod squad universe that we had there. You integrated seamlessly into the team. We all loved. You were all pound round of the office. Then the world changes the world shuts down very unfortunate for you because you only got to experience, uh, life on campus for a good month or two before.

Uh, we all got sent home. So then we became good friends over slack and good friends over zoom. So it's apropos that we reconnect. But I've always felt that you are in the short time, I've known you that you're like seven years older than me, because I think you're so mature and smart and experienced.

You've been all over the country. I mean, you grew up in Connecticut, then you were in, then he went to college at Kentucky. You were in Los Angeles and you were in Nashville. And then you ended up going back to Connecticut to work at ESPN for a job that you could impact. You just bought a house like you're in this relation, like you're this long relationship.

So I look up to you. I admire you. And I can't believe you're only like a year older than me. It's crazy. So, so excited to talk to you today because you are, of course, working in the podcast industry, you work on a bunch of shows at ESPN. You're very knowledgeable and this is a topic podcasts that people in our generation, I mean, me and you, we're smack dab in the middle of this kind of revolution that has happened over the last few weeks.

And podcasts are listened to the most by our demographic. And so me and you know, a lot about it. So I would think it would be very valuable for us to, uh, kind of have the conversation about that. But for. Welcome. How are you? Well, thank you. That was probably the nicest introduction anybody has ever given me.

So thank you. Uh, it's an honor to be here. Uh, we were just saying right before we started, I'm so impressed with everything you've done with this podcast over the last year or two, that you've been working on it. So congratulations for everything you've been doing. Uh, but thank you. Thank you for having me.

Thank you. I appreciate that you are one of the kindest people. I know. So I appreciate that first. Before we talk about podcasting, uh, you just bought a house. I mean, you had trouble finding your microphone. You said because your life is in shambles right now, as you are moving from, as you and your boyfriend are moving from your apartment to your new home.

Someone was trying to convince me to invest in real estate the other day. And I just said like, no, I have zero interest in real estate ever. I mean, I can't make up my mind. I cannot fathom having buying a property and being responsible for it for years. Or maybe having tenants or like having to make a commitment beyond a year, lease scares the living hell out of me.

So I have no idea how you did this. Why did you want to. Uh, well, so if you would've asked me this even a year ago, I had the exact same mindset I what's funny is, and I was just joking about this with my boyfriend is that I have moved every single year for the last 10 years. I've never stayed in one place.

Oh yeah. I've gone through countless apartments. The cities, uh, because I love, I love moving. I know a lot of people dread moving, but I love it. I love moving to a new place. I love meeting new people. Uh, I've always been the kind of person to. If given the opportunity, I'm just going to up my life and go, uh, but then everything kind of changed, you know, with the pandemic, with my new job, with my boyfriend.

And so now I'm in a much slower lifestyle of this is life for the next however many years. Um, and so I just, my mindset has changed I think, with the pandemic and having to. Start a new job and a new place that, you know, I grew up here in Connecticut, but I wasn't, I didn't really have many friends from high school.

I didn't really hold on to any of those friendships. Um, so it was a lot like starting over, you know, I was much like everybody else who starts at ESPN where I didn't, I didn't know a ton of people. So when I came back here, I've known my boyfriend since high school. So when we reconnected. Seamless and easy, but with all of my other friendships, it's like, I'm starting over again.

Um, and so doing all of that through the pandemic, I kind of figured, well maybe, maybe moving around so much, like this is the new adventure, this is a new excitement for me, you know, I've been moving all over the place. And so this is a new type of excitement that I've never really had before. So that was kind of what drew drew me into.

Finally settling down somewhere. Maybe I'll reach that same epiphany as you, because I very much also like moving also live somewhere new every year. I enjoy the process for a lot of the same reasons that you just said new challenges. You know, new, new people and new places, like all of those things, I value new experiences.

And when you're young, I think is the, the advantage to it is the time to take advantage of all of that freedom. Absolutely. And so I don't know if I'll ever, like, I, I imagine I both settled down at some point, but I do want to, uh, if you don't mind me prying really quick, you said you reconnected with your boyfriend who you knew from high school.

How did that. So we, we met so long ago, you know, freshman year of high school either. We can't even figure out when exactly it was. We were, we both did a volunteer group in high school. So we, I can't decide if it was the volunteer group we did, or if we met at, you know, some random high school house party, you know, I don't know exactly why we didn't go to the same high school.

We grew up in neighboring towns. So I knew of him. Yeah, it actually. Uh, he played football. I played soccer and basketball. So we kind of ran in the same circles. We had similar friend groups. Um, I knew a lot of his friends. He knew a lot of. So we had known each other through high school. We were friendly.

Um, but we never, we never kind of explored that. He had a girlfriend, I had a boyfriend or high school, and then he went to Yukon. I went to Kentucky. So we, we stayed friends. And every time I came home for, you know, break Christmas and skipping through college, uh, we would connect and, you know, hang out. But it was never anything more than, Hey, I, you know, we know we really liked each other, but it just wasn't gonna work the distance wasn't gonna.

Uh, we were just at very selfish times in our lives where you're in college, you know, live it up, be where you are present in the moment I'm going to be where I am present in the moment. We're not worrying about what each other is doing. You know, we didn't want to put that pressure on each other. And so we kind of always left it up to, Hey, if we're ever in the same place at the same time, we'll explore it.

Uh, and it just kind of worked out that way where I was texting him right when I got this job interview two years ago. Hey, I think I might actually be moving home, you know, a decade later. Do you maybe want to hang out when I move home and we ended up hanging out, like the day I moved home and started dating instantly, it just kind of clicked that way.

Yeah. I think we kind of always knew it was going to work out. It just, all of the timing and all the pieces to fall into. Oh, that's an awesome story that, uh, that warms my heart. I'm so happy for you guys. Now, you guys have just bought a house together, which again, I can't fathom, it's obviously like a ridiculously intense process and I'm sure you learned so much, uh, don't really want to know you kind of figure out exactly.

What was the thing that surprised you the most, that was most unexpected. Um, all of, all of the stuff that goes into buying a house, you know, Simply and just because, you know, I'm dumb when it comes to this kind of stuff. I just thought, Hey, I like this house. Here's my money. Take it. Uh, it very much does not go that way.

There's, you know, there's all the inspections and, you know, especially in this job or house market right now, it's, um, it's crazy. You know, there's not a lot. That's on the market and what's on the market. You've got 50 offers for one house and people are. Crazy outbidding each other. And so it's, it's kind of that, you know, how much money do we spend on a house?

Is it worth it? You know, do we like it enough to outbid the next person? And it's all these things that I just had never thought about? Um, I joke that I, I'm not a math person. I don't know. It's part of the reason why I'm in what I do now. Uh, so I learned all about, you know, finances and you know, what, how much money it takes to go into a house loan.

So all this stuff that I had never learned, uh, so I think all of everything that goes into buying a house was just so eye-opening. I was like, oh my God, this is really hard. It's not as easy as they make it seem where you just show up and they hand the keys and say, Hey, this is yours now. The term 30 year mortgage scares the living hell out of me.

Oh, it's terrifying. Yeah. Well, when we signed the papers, uh, our attorney joke with us and said, so, uh, so yeah, sign the dotted line. This is yours for the next 30 years until 2050. It's yours. And I was like, oh my God, that sounds so crazy. I know. I'm like, I don't even know what I'm doing tomorrow. Let alone 30 years from now.

But, uh, but yeah, I think it's, it's a new type of excitement. Well, uh, congrats to you. That is awesome. So, uh, you're here today to talk about podcasting. So I just kind of wants to ask you straight up. Why do you. You like podcasts so much. And I don't necessarily mean why do you like working on podcasts so much?

Why do you like the medium so much? Well, so what's funny is I didn't go to school thinking that I was going to work in podcasting. You know, when we were both in college, I mean, podcasts, weren't a thing. So I never listened to podcasts. I didn't even know what a podcast was. Uh, but when I graduated. And my first job was an intern for sports center out in LA.

When I had finished that internship, I didn't know where else I was going to go, but the NFL network had an opening and their podcast. It was relatively new. They only had a few podcasts, but they said, Hey, we'll teach you basically what a podcast is. You have all of the basic editing skills. We'll teach you everything else of what a podcast is.

And I was like, okay. They're like, do you listen to podcasts? And I was like, no, I have no idea what that is, but, okay. So I started working in podcasts like six, seven years ago now. Um, but what's crazy is I. I S I thought that what my life was, my career trajectory was going to be was sideline reporting, live television, you know, that kind of thing.

But now that I've been opened to podcasting, I don't think I would ever leave this space because it's so creative. There's so many things you could do with it. The most unique thing. And the most fun thing about podcasting is that you could talk about literally anything. You could have a podcast where you just talk with your friend about nothing.

You can have a podcast that's so niche and unique that you hone into a specific group of people. You can talk so broadly that you're using. Appealing to the mass audience. It's just, there's so many different things you could do with it. I think the creative part and like the endless possibility part is what's so exciting about, I love most about it.

Oh man. Yeah. I, I agree with so much of what you just said because in the traditional media, Elements that, that we grew up with TV radio specifically. There's there's restrictions. It's this segment lasts this long. Then we have to go to break. There's all these commercials. There's things you can say.

There's things you cannot say. There's areas you can go in and things you can't go into podcasting. You can like it is open-ended. You can do a nine hour show. I wouldn't recommend it. You can do a nine hour show. On edited one scripted, do whatever you want. You can have four hours of dead air and it doesn't matter.

Uh, that's what I love so much about it is it's the freedom. It's the ability to, to speak your mind without anyone having to, you know, tell you whether you're right or wrong. Um, the thing I love most about it as a listener, and this is obviously. What we're now doing when we're watching things as well, just on your own time, whenever you want, you don't have to tune into the radio show, live at 7:00 PM.

It's like, all right, well, I've got something going on at 7:00 PM, but the podcast is up and I can listen to it at 7:00 AM. The next day when I'm walking my dog, when I'm in my garden, when I'm doing my dishes, when I'm running on the treadmill, like, I just love the nature of being able to plug and play.

Anytime when I'm on the move, because I personally am a person. Like if you remember me, I'm just always moving. Like I can not sit still and watch a TV show. So I just love listening to things because I can be doing things, doing productive things, and still, I. I prefer kind of educational podcast and just kind of learning that way.

There's so much, I love about it. I could talk about it forever. And there's so many different formats of podcasting. You know, I used to produce a podcast with two of my friends out in LA, who I met working at NFL network, Erica, Tim Posey, who still works at the NFL network. Um, she's around the NFL. Lead producer.

Um, and now Emma samaki, she just got married, um, a few years ago. So shout out to her. Um, so I used to work on a podcast with the both of them that they still do to this day called the broad. It's very scripted. And so they, when they it's a comedy scripted podcast. And so when they go into it, they have these funny bits and these, you know, specific segments that they curate and they think out beforehand.

So it's very thought out and it's a, it's a. Versus I've worked on podcasts and I've been a guest on podcasts. I've listened to podcasts that are very unscripted, so it's so cool. The different types of podcasts you can have, it could be totally scripted where you are literally reading off of a piece of paper.

You know, you structure the show like you would alive television show a radio show. You could just go, just talk about whatever you want to talk about. You're not editing anything, you know, it's, it's total free reign and I think that's, what's so fun about it and it, it appeals to everybody, you know, not everybody likes to listen to talk radio.

Not everybody likes to sit down and watch. Sports center at night. Not everybody likes those types of shows, but podcasts, I feel like can appeal to literally anybody there's comedy. Yeah. There's comedy, there's education. There's, you know, audio books, you know, I, I even started listening to the office where some of the actors are now doing deep dives into previous episodes.

And that's really cool. And it's something I had never thought about. Like, Literally explaining specific scenes that I'm like, oh, I remember that episode. That was really funny. And they're going deep into what made that scene, you know, what went behind the scenes of it? How did they come up with it? The live reaction.

So there's so many different things you could do with it. That's, you know, it's awesome. And there is, and this is kind of why I fell in love with audio. Like you, I didn't envision this for my career. I mean, I wanted to work on documentaries on TV, documentaries, kind of just be involved in that. I didn't know what role, but that was what I wanted to do.

And then I just kind of got thrown into audio again. I don't know how. But I fell in love with it. And this is something that this is why audio still wins. When people talk about radio dying and what is the future of audio? Yes, radio is dead, but audio is very much alive and it's only getting more popular because this is something that has been happening since the beginning of time.

It is storytelling. It is literally like the caveman sitting around the fire, communicating stories. Painting on the painting on the walls. It is the same shit just in a different medium. And so what is so great about this is that there is nothing more intimate than hearing someone through your headphones.

That's predominantly how we're listening, hearing someone speak to you through their, through your head. It feels like you are speaking that, that the host is speaking directly to you. It doesn't feel that way on a TV show. It doesn't feel that way. When you're reading, when you're reading a, you know, a book or a blog, when someone is speaking to you in your ears, you feel a connection to them that you cannot feel in any other medium.

And that's what makes it so powerful. And that's why, you know, nerds like you and I care about audio quality because when you get a, like a. Sounding voice. And like you get it in your ears, it just hits differently and you feel a connection to them. And so when I think about my favorite podcast, I just think about, I feel like I know the host, even though most times I actually don't, I've never met them.

I'm never going to meet them, but you feel like, you know, them, you feel like you, uh, you know, that they are a part of your lives and that if you did come with. You know, like come cross paths with them and wherever that you'd be able to have a conversation with them, which is so cool. Yeah. I love that.

Like the aspect of you feel like you're hanging out with a friend and I think that that's, that's what I look for in podcasts. Like when I listen to so many different types of podcasts, I'm a huge standup comedian fan. So I listened to a lot of standup comedians, pod. Um, so I listened to a lot of comedy podcasts.

I also like to cry. I might listen to some true crime podcasts, some sports podcasts, you know, a little bit of everything. The one I liked the most is when the host brings you into their world and makes you feel like you're just sitting with them. One-on-one, you're their friend. They talk to you like a friend.

They don't talk above you as if, you know, whatever they're saying is something that you should just be taking and nodding your head. Yes. What you're saying is gospel, of course. No, it's a conversation. You know, when I, I catch myself sometimes, like when I'm listening to a podcast, laughing out loud, Agreeing with the host or all, or, you know, I'll, I'll gas would be like, oh my God, why did they say that?

Or like, you know, you're, it's almost, it's literally, as if you're sitting down with a friend and your friend said something and you're like, wait, go back. Why'd you say that? Or, oh, I really liked that. Like, let's keep talking about that. And so even though you're not actually communicating with the host, I think the best podcasts make you feel like you are in a way, because your coming up with your side of the conversation in your head while listening to them, and it makes you feel like, you know them when you do.

And on top of that, I think the, the other great thing. Now, some, some shoes, some shows don't do this at all. Other shows, do a great, is the community aspect of it with listeners. It's, it's interesting. Like if you come across someone in your everyday life, who's a fan of breaking bad. Let's say you're both big breaking bad fans.

Like, oh, you watch bacon breaking bad too. Oh, that's cool. Let's talk about it. But when you come across someone like you listen to the same podcast as. I don't know if I'm being biased here or not, but it's just like, oh my gosh, I can't believe you listen to his podcast. Did you listen to step? So what did you think about this, blah, blah, blah, blah.

It's so cool. The community aspect of it is awesome. Uh, the show that I'm working on right now at the ringer, one of them, this ringer MMA show that we're doing is it's on this app called Spotify greenroom, which is just like this live audio app. It's kind of like radio without commercials. It's crazy how cyclical it all is.

It's basically, and this is the thing that's happening on Twitter spaces and clubhouse, where you are inviting people. Hey, click this link and you get to join into this intimate little community. The hosts are talking, the listeners get to get to chat and call. When I call into the show and comment amongst.

You get to create this community feeling where you, the host knows the listeners and the listeners know the listeners and all parts of the world, you can connect and I'm actually wearing the sweatshirt, uh, call her daddy right now. Shout out. I think it's the best podcast in the world because of how, because of how versatile it is.

I don't think it's the best content in the world. But I think when you talk about what Alex does, creative wise and production, the types of people that. You know, the types of people she brings on the community that is the daddy gang. It's the best podcast community in the world. Like the New York times daily, isn't doing that Joe Rogan experience.

Isn't doing that. Those are other top shows great shows in their own rights, but they don't, they don't hold a candle to call her daddy. When it comes to building a community, you feel like, you know, the people that are also listening to this, even if you don't, that's awesome. It's something to talk about something to connect, connect to.

And that's why I just kind of love media or like this kind of entertainment as a whole, because it's an escape from. Your everyday life. That is a. Sometimes not so pleasant. Yeah. And it's you feel like you're a part of this like exclusive club where like, you know, a lot of times, you know, it growing up, you, you turn to the internet for certain, you know, instances where, like you said, you know, normal life.

Boring. It's hard. It's, you know, it's got its challenges. So you turn to things like podcasts or an internet, you know, blogs, certain communities that make you feel like you're a part of something. Uh, and it's even better when you feel like you're a part of this club with all of these people that you might not know anybody else in that club, but you can talk to them about something.

Um, I admire everything that Alex has done, or for every reason you just said, I think that. I got my first taste of what it's like to experience that type of community from a different side of it. When I was working on Katie and Owen's podcasts and I got brought on as a third host, I had no idea that so many people not only cared about.

What I was saying, but who I was and what my life was like. And I was going on Reddit and people were congratulating me on certain things and picking out certain things of my life. And I was like, oh my God, people actually pay attention. Like people care about what I'm doing in my own personal life.

That's so far removed from their lives. So. It's a really cool experience to be able to see it from both sides of it. I'm such a huge fan of color. Daddy. I'm such a huge fan of the basement yard, a podcast out of New York that, you know, Joe Santa Gado has done the exact same thing where it's this niche group of people that tune into this show every week.

And everybody, if people know who the other people are. So like when you go on through the Reddit page, you're like, oh, I know that person. I know that. You don't know that person, but you remember them because you're commenting back and forth. You're having these conversations about the show and the content and the host, and when they can make you feel like it's not just a show, they're not just talking about, you know, Alex giving, you know, a spiel on the latest date she went on and you know, all these different sex tips.

It's not just the content she's putting out there. It's the storylines. You know, these real life things that you could have real conversations with real people about these types of real things that I think it's so unique. And it's so cool that like, you know, you're, you're able to do certain things like that with.

Absolutely. And that's why I feel so grateful to work on this medium. Again, something I never envisioned for myself. I I've told the story a couple of times on this podcast. Um, my first year in Connecticut, now you didn't have to deal with this. Like I did. Um, I was miserable. I had a terrible schedule. Uh, I was working in radio, like hated the job, hated the schedule off Monday, Tuesdays working nights, weekends, overnights, like thought I wasn't doing anything of any value.

And I still had never really listened to a podcast then, but I, I did start listening to some shows just because I was like, I just started listening to ESPN. Podcasts is all like, well, this is really all I know. But then I started listening to others. You know, you listen to a ringer show or I listened to some of my self-help shows and it was the people that I was listening to that were giving me something to look forward to every day.

Like my life sucked and. It was these shows that I was looking forward to every day that were serving as that escape for me, that were giving me, giving me something to look forward to. And when I'm producing a podcast, now I always keep that 21 year old Troy in mind that there is someone that is listening to this show right now, or that is looking forward to listening to the show at 4:00 PM.

Wednesday afternoon for their commute home, from their job that they hate. I do. I try to work so hard on, on my shows and do a really good job on them. And so that I can put out the best product, you know, for the people that really need this in their lives to get through their day. And I think that's, that's so cool that you bring that up because even though my experience working here at ESPN, I feel like I finally got to a place where my schedule is the way I want it.

I'm working on things that I actually love doing. I feel like I'm making a difference with my work. That wasn't always the case. Uh, you know, I've, I've had countless jobs. I've worked at so many different companies over the last few years. I've moved around from, like you said, LA to Nashville. When I was living in Nashville originally I was working in country music radio.

It was a really unique experience. It was not the experience for me. I'm waking up at three in the morning. I'm at the studio by 4:00 AM. I am not a morning person whatsoever. So this entire lifestyle change was not only, you know, hard on me personally, but I didn't love what I was doing. I didn't love the work I was doing and I didn't feel like I was making a difference anymore.

So, like you said, I was so looking forward to when I got off of work, I would make sure I would go to the gym for an hour before I would sleep for six hours after my shift. You know what I get off at 11:00 AM, uh, when everybody else is, you know, at work, I'd be at the gym listening to certain podcasts.

That that was my escape. That was my, okay. Let me just get through. God awful morning shift because I can listen to that episode with that host that I'm looking forward to, I can escape for a couple of hours and then I'm going to bed. So it's, you know, it's moments like that. Or I remember when I was first working at ESPN downtown LA, my first internship right out of college, I was working the late night sports center.

So. I was getting off of work at like two in the morning. And so I'm driving home at the time. I had never been to LA before, so I just picked an apartment in a place that I thought was a good area. Little did I know that it was an hour and a half commute to where my job was. I had no idea what I was doing.

So when I would drive home in the morning at like two in the morning, I wouldn't get home until. 3 3 30 and on my drive home, I would listen to podcasts not only to keep myself awake and keep myself engaged on the drive home. Um, but that was also my escape of, oh my God. I'm so tired work was really stressful.

I'm trying to learn all these things, improve myself because I'm a recent college graduate. Yeah. I don't know what I'm doing with my life. I'm living in a new city where I have zero friends. I just moved here. I don't know my way around. I'm commuting an hour to work because I didn't pick the right location to live in.

And now this is my escape. This is what I'm looking forward to. And so, yeah, everything that you just said, I think it's now when I'm in a position where. The work that I'm doing, I feel like I'm making an impact. And I it's so rewarding when listeners of the podcast that I work on, say, this is what I look forward to.

I absolutely love this segment, things like that. It gives me a special type of. Satisfaction because it's like, that's what I look forward to. And I know that when you look forward to that segment, I look forward to that segment because it's also my escape and I know the type of feelings you're going through.

Would you say that you like that kind of stuff? So it's everything you just said. I completely agree with. Thank you for sharing that story. Uh, it's awesome. I know, I know a lot of people can relate to that. Me and you are very lucky that we have gotten to the points where we are in our careers, where for as you know, there are so many people in this business that now.

Work on the profile of shows and with the profile of talent that me and you do. I mean, there's so many people who are just trying to get a hundred listeners. You work at ESPN. I mean, you start a new podcast, you're getting thousands, right, right off the bat. Like we don't have to work that hard to build an audience.

And so, uh, you know, communicating with that audience that we have is so rewarding. And then even like for my show, when people message me or, you know, share something or. I'm telling me that they like it, whatever, like I am not. Year, plus I've been doing this. I haven't received one negative comment from anyone, which is awesome.

Now again, if like a thousand people were listening, probably there will be more, it might be a few mics. There might be more. Everyone who's, you know, who listens watches has been super supportive and I love that. And it only makes me want to do it more. Yeah. I think that, you know, when you have that type of community built up where the people that are tuning into your show genuinely liked the content.

They like you, they want to listen to what you have to say. I think it's, it's such a positive encouraging community. Yeah. When I, when I started working with Katie Dolan and her show, her fan base is so connected and they're such genuinely nice people, complete strangers to you and I, but totally nice genuine people that I now.

You know, quote unquote, internet, friends away, right? Like when I go on Twitter and I tweet something, I have, you know, some of her fans tweeting at me saying congratulations, or I agree, or I disagree. And, you know, we're sparking a genuine conversations and I feel like I'm friends with these people. And so I think that when you create that type of community, it's so rewarding and encouraging, like you said, it makes you want to, I've gone through so many different.

Battles with like social media and putting my name and face out there with kind of the, the fear of, oh, if I say something or if I do something and I put it out to the masses, people are going to disagree and I am such a fear. I have such a fear of. People not liking me, I guess you can say, or people ripping me apart.

And I think that pretty much everybody can agree with. You know, when you say something, you don't want a room full of people to say, well, that's wrong. And to, you know, yell at you for it. But I have such a fear of, I just want to keep the peace and I want everybody to like everybody. And I, so I have that fear of, if I tweet something and people disagree with it, I'm like, oh, should I have tweeted out?

Oh my God, I have to delete it. Tweeted and deleted so many times I've posted on Instagram and deleted the picture immediately because I was like, oh, I shouldn't have posted that. It didn't look good. And so when you create a community of people around you, that hype you up and that support what you're doing and support the content you're putting out there, it's so rewarding.

And it gets rid of that fear of my doing the right thing, my saying the right things to people like me. Gets rid of all of that fear, that community accepts you and you can post, I mean, you have the right community. I mean, out like Alex Cooper is a great example. I mean, she posts photos all the time of herself and like her full sweatsuit and like shout out, shout out.

Yeah. I think that, you know, when you create a community like that, of course, there are always going to be people that either disagree or who hate for no reason. Absolutely. And of course, somebody like Alex who has millions of followers, I bet millions of people are out there disagreeing and hating for no reason.

And just simply to do that. Um, but when you focus on the people that genuinely care and like what you're doing. You know, that's why she is so successful and why she's created the community she has, because she doesn't focus on those people that hate what she does. She's focusing on the people that appreciate and love what she's doing.

And so that's why she is so successful. Quick side note, you mentioned that, you know, you've worked a bunch of different jobs in a short amount of time. Do you think it's a bad thing because I I've had. The older generation and I love to criticize older generation on this show. They love this Troy, like you can't just keep bouncing around from job to job and place to place.

You're going to get a reputation in the industry is the guy who can't stay anywhere. Why would they hire you? I feel like that's the wrong way to, to think about it. If you're not happy in a job, or if you're not growing as much as you would, like if they don't pay you as much as you think you deserve, or they're just not the right fit for you.

Go try something else. Where do you fall on that? I, 1000% agree with you and I think. I've been told so many times by, I love my parents. My parents have said the same thing to me. I've had family members, friends, you know, friends who are, are working the same jobs I've had since I graduated college. Right?

The same company is that's not my mindset. And I don't think that's necessarily this industry. I think what's unique about this industry is it's a revolving door, no matter where you are. So I think that what's kind of not necessarily difficult, but it's a different idea to grasp for people who don't work in this industry, per se.

It's the same thing with, you know, being an actor, an actress, or a singer, or as somebody who is working in an industry where you're not working the same desk job every day. I think that. Personally, I've always had the mindset of get as much experience while you're young, as you can. So I dedicated my early twenties to going to college out of state and a place where I knew absolutely no one, because I wanted to gain that experience.

I come from a very small town in Connecticut. I know everybody first, middle and last name. I know everybody's extended family. I didn't want that for myself. When I went to college, I wanted to throw myself out of that comfort zone. So. Once I kind of decided that I was comfortable being uncomfortable like that.

I decided let's just move wherever. Let's take whatever job opportunity. So went to LA worked for two different places. Well, actually three, I worked for ESPN. I was an intern that I worked for NFL network and then podcasts one. So I worked for a bunch of different places. And then I decided I didn't, I don't want to be here anymore.

And so mid football season of my second NFL season, I gave them notice that after that season I was leaving and it was a shock to, you know, my friends out there. They were like, why you're living in the greatest city? It's magical LA LA land. Why would you leave? I was unhappy. I was, you know, I, I just personally gone through a recent breakup.

I just didn't want to be. In that place anymore. I felt like where I was, wasn't serving me anymore. And so I figured now is the time to focus on my career again and move somewhere else. Moved to Nashville. Didn't have a job. So without the guidance of my parents, my parents said, do not leave a job until you have a new one.

I left my job without having another one. So I moved to Nash. Uh, within a week, I started working for the Bobby bone shadow, which is the group, the biggest country music radio show. Of course, like I said, I, didn't not that I didn't love the experience. The people were fantastic. The show is fantastic, but it's not the type of work I wanted to be doing.

I knew I wanted to get back into sports. So I did the job. But then quickly after that, uh, our local ESPN radio affiliate in Nashville was looking for a part-time producer now going from a full-time job to a part-time job. Once again, everybody was telling me, don't do that. You're not going to be able to afford rent.

I certainly wasn't. So what I decided to do, I quit my job and started working at ESPN radio and was working for dirt money, working overnight shifts. It was. A unique experience in the sense that from an outsider's perspective, you'd say, what the hell are you doing? Why did you do that? Why did you leave, you know, a secure job position to go work overnight shifts, work part time, making $10 an hour, not being able to afford your rent in a city.

That's very expensive, although they don't tell you that, um, And I was like, well, because I love doing it. And I needed that experience. And I truly believe that I wouldn't have gotten my job offer here at ESPN. If I didn't switch back into sports and throw myself into that position and say, Hey, I know I'm, you know, I'm going to predators hockey games and I'm working, you know, behind the scenes interviewing these people, the radio station I'm working for.

Doesn't have the budget. Promote that, and just show you that that's the work that I'm doing and they can't pay me any more than $10 an hour, but Hey, this is the work I'm doing. It's really cool. Hire me somewhere else. And it eventually ended up working out where I now have a full-time job at ESPN, but along the way, it wasn't like that.

I worked very many part-time jobs, working paycheck to paycheck, working two jobs at once I was working at NFL network and podcast one, trying to just make rent. So it's, you know, it's those types of experiences that I'm thankful for, because I wouldn't have gotten to where I am now, if I didn't do that, but I also think it reflects poorly upon you.

Right. And I exactly, and I think that, you know, the older generation, my parents' generation, friends and family who don't necessarily work in this type of environment would say, you're crazy. Why are you doing that? But I am such a supporter of. Just do it. What's the worst that can happen if you're, if you find yourself in a position where you take that part-time job.

And now you're like, oh my God, I really can't afford my rent. I really can't do this. Okay. Then now we need to pivot. Now we need to go back to something more secure. Now we need to figure things out a little bit more, but I think that above anything else, happiness is the most important thing. If you're not loving what you're doing and if you're not happy, what's it worth.

So I think that. If you want to move somewhere, do it. If you want to quit your job and find a new one, do it. I, I'm such a supporter of, if that's, what's going to make you happy, be happy, you know what? What's anybody to tell you. You have to stick in that job or you have to stay in that city. You have to stick out that least.

If you're not happy, screw it. Life short, everything that you just said, right there is, you know, you could put on a billboard for this, this movement that we're calling. The great resignation is what all the newspapers and such are calling it. That is kind of how. During COVID as, as a result of COVID, as people have realized, oh shit, like I can lose anything at any time I can lose that person.

And that eight time life is fragile. We were all, so go, go, go taking everything for granted. And then we lost some things. And then we slowed down and actually spent some time with ourselves and loved ones that worked for home. And, and we're like, this is kind of like, this is kind of nice. There's a different way to live.

Oh, yeah. To bring it back to podcasting. I'm like, I don't remember doing things a year and a half ago, two years ago for the ESPN daily show going in on a Sunday night after already being there Sunday morning, going there at, at midnight, staying up till 2:00 AM and like drying and grind, grinding away.

Then waking up again at five to work on my baseball show the next day. I can do all that from home now. Like, why am I, why am I doing that? I don't need to do that anymore. And everything that you just said is, you know, outside of media, just a reason why young people are leading this charge of, if you're not happy in your job, leave it, go, find something else that'll make, that'll be more fulfilling.

And there's also so many more ways to make money now. I mean, say what you want about Tik TOK. I had a great conversation on last week's podcast with Eric Jackman about the beauty of tick-tock. There are so many ways. And I know this from starting my own business. To just bet on yourself and to make your own money and to not have to go through a third party, a company, a big corporate structure to make it work for you.

You can make your own thing happen. It takes a lot of work, dedication research, of course, but it's so much more possible than it used to be. Yeah, I think, you know, it, especially now with younger people realize. The old way of doing things, where you go to college to study one thing, you graduate, you work with the same company for 30, 40, 50 years.

And he retired. You're done. Uh, that's just not the thing anymore. I mean, but what about the 401k, Christina? Yeah, it's just, it's so crazy to think about. Like I joked with my parents that when I took this ESPN job that I currently have, it's the first time I've ever had benefits. It's the first time that anybody's ever offered me a plan for retirement.

Because I was never thinking that far in advance. I was literally just saying to my mom yesterday that the weirdest thing about getting a house is thinking past one year, because I've always been in the mindset of, well, this is just my lease. I'm in a lease for a year or six months or however long it is.

And that's all I'm thinking up till I'm thinking up until the end of the year. And then where am I going next? Am I staying in this one spot? Am I finding someplace new? And so I think. It's just a different mindset and you know, everything that you just said. I think so many people over the last two years spent more time, not only by themselves, in a place where they can reflect on life, their job, you know, their.

Their state of happiness, really to say like, am I happy with everything I'm doing? You know, it, you see so many people entering new relationships or moving across the country or changing jobs because it's, that's, what's making them happy. And I think to bring everything back full circle, I think. Job-wise you have to find what makes you happy.

And I think that podcasting is so open and unique and it's got a space for literally everybody that I think that I'm finally in a position where I'm touching podcasts, that touch people and there's something for everybody. You might not be a fan of a totally football centric podcast like Adam Schefter, but Hey, maybe first take her take is for you because they talk about everything.

You don't like any of that, you want to listen to just MMA or just hockey. We've got that too. You know, if you don't want to listen to any of those types of things, there are comedy podcasts, there are educational podcasts. There's, there's something for everybody to make you escape the current situation you're in to make you feel good and happy for the hour to three hours.

The podcast is, and you know, that's the beauty of. You're the best, Christina. Uh, I could talk to you for hours about this, but you are a very busy woman. You work on like 18 episodes of podcasts a week. They've got you doing so we'll get you out of here on this for all the amazing things that we just said about podcasting over the last 40 minutes or so, what do you think the future of it is?

Do you think it's because there's a lot of people. That are calling this a fad that are saying, oh, there's, there's so many shows like it's so easy to create a show. That's again, the beauty of it, it is easy to create a show. It is easy to get the equipment to put out a quality show. It, it is easy, but it's not necessarily easy to sustain a following, build a show.

That's why a lot of people get it. That's why a lot of people get out or only four months after getting in. A lot of people during COVID, like COVID only accelerated the interest in podcasting. What do you think, where do you think all of this. I honestly think it's only going up from here. I think that we're noticing over the last, what, 10 years, the absolute explosion of social media and how Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, Tik, TOK, YouTube, all of these, all of these things that we had.

What I was in middle school and high school that are so different. Now we use them for such different purposes. Now, when I was in high school, I use Twitter to talk to my friends, tweet about what class I was going to next. Now I use Twitter as sometimes a new source to follow certain reporters, to see what they're up to.

I follow it to get injury updates on my favorite athletes. Like you're following people on Twitter for a very different purpose. People use Instagram in a different way. People make money off of Instagram. I was, you know, a couple of years ago. Yeah, it was a couple of years ago posting, you know, pictures of my cat on Instagram.

And now it's, you know, people actually make real hardcore money off of this. People use YouTube and Tik TOK as a means of a career. And so I think that although a lot of people like to, you know, turn their nose to people who use those types of outlets, Hardcore money. And to use that as a career outlet, I think that, you know, that that's just the way life is going.

Now. I think that everything is turning digital. I think that there's so many endless possibilities who knows what the next social media thing is going to be. Tik TOK came about a couple of years ago and now look at what it is. It's huge. So who knows what the next thing is, but I think. Podcasts and in particular it's so endless.

And it's so open-ended like you said earlier that there's, I don't see any end in sight. I think if anything, it's just more and more people are going to get into it. Um, and it's just going to, it's going to be the new biggest thing. I mean, it's, it's already on the rise now. So many people are into it, but I don't think it's stopping anytime soon.

I don't know if he's right, because I don't know what you and I are going to do for that. Like, you can't, you can't do math. I bought a house, but if I don't have a job, if it looks like removed, but again, probably, and also, uh, the metaverse is going to change things. I don't know how podcasts, but in all of that, but that's a conversation for a different day.

Uh, Christina Buswell, producer of gosh, RCDC in the crease. Bill Barnwell show the Adam Schefter podcast, the daily wage. First take her take. She does it all amazing woman and Christina, thank you so much for joining me for the conversation and good luck with everything that you've got going on. Thank you so much for having me.